my 09 d8's check engine light comes on every now and again

[miralas]

hey guys first of all this is my first sled, only ridden it twice and everybody i know rides skidoo so i cant go to them for answers. i tried to search this but i'm not seeing anything specific to whats happening to me so i figured i start my own thread. this is whats happening:

1st hour i took it out i went off the trail, got stuck, rolled the sled and had someone else ride it up, and that's when i first heard the bog. the check engine started flashing so we killed it, looked at it, and figured maybe some snow might have gotten into the intake. ran fine for about 2 hours then when i went to climb i had it wide open then it cut down on power and the check engine came back on. didn't roll it, there was no light powder out so i don't think anything had gotten into the intake, though the previous owner had put some pretty open vents under the windshield. so i turned the sled off then back on and it was fine for a few more hours then did it again.

the next day we went out and i had never even rolled it before it did it, but there was some light snow blowing around. the second day it did this probably about 4 times. i would just notice the power cut and the check engine flashing.

so i went home, checked my plugs, there brown/super dark brown, so normal to a little rich, shouldn't be anything to worry about there. i asked the previous owner if this has ever happened to him and he said never, but i know he's never worked on this sled before, he just takes it to the shop everytime he tought something could be wrong(deep pockets). i know the sled has had all its updates, as it just came out of the shop the week he sold it to me at the end of November.

i cant really check forums at work(military) but from what i just seen in a few threads people say i need to seal up around the headlights and put in powder valves. could that really be that easy? would a little bit of water in the intake set off my check engine light? need serious help, my pockets seem to be broke, but i could throw some money at it as long as i know it's going into the right direction. i would like to be able to just jump on and ride this thing worry free for a weekend.

thanks a lot in advance.

 

[dub]

Sounds to me like DETO! Pull the exhaust vales and look at the pistons with a flashlight. We have had 3 go down in 3 days!!

Not that this is your problem for sure but it sure would be nice to know how to fix these things.

 

[ragincajun]

i have been fighting this also for a few weeks now and i am 90% sure it is not detonating(good fuel and high elev)....the sled goes into limp mode and cuts timing and pours the fuel to it. i took it in to the stealership and suposidly polaris had a reflash that made the det sensor very sensative...too sensative and **** would go nuts. they put the new one in and it was back to normal....for a few days. i had insulation coming out of my clam shell and my sled wouldnt idle so i took the tb's off and cleaned them and the reeds...both of which were filthy and wrapped my pipe in header wrap. got it all back together and sled idles perfect now. i put a little sea foam in the gas to clean the injectors and it runs waay better....BUT the damn thing has gone into limp mode 3 times in the few miles i have ridden it. im starting to get very frustrated and thinkin about goin back to doo. i love the chassis but their electronics and fueling is $hit.

btw i have checked intake and exhaust sides of pistons and they look good, no signs of det on top either.

 

[AKSNOWRIDER]

Sounds to me like DETO! Pull the exhaust vales and look at the pistons with a flashlight. We have had 3 go down in 3 days!!

Not that this is your problem for sure but it sure would be nice to know how to fix these things.

x2...try buying fuel at a different supplier..also check the fuel wires on the back edge of the clutch cover(under the black belt holder)and make sure they are set for non ethanol fuel or ethanol fuel depending on which you are running...also run it by the dealer and ask them to make sure it has the latest map in it..sounds like it has the early 10 map and it is to sensitive to deto...as for the headlite and the headlite adjuster, drop the plenium out of the hood and inspect around the headlite, it should have a good seal on the foam weatherstrip all the way around, if not add more or use silicone and seal it, the adjuster a peice of tape will seal it...

 

[theshadowrider]

When is the last time you changed your fuel filter? I would start with that.

 

[Joe57]

Put a PCV on and it should be good to go.Mine did the same thing runs great now with a PCV.Dealer sold me one for cost he said I didn't need the expense of going down and he was busy enough as it is. OH and by the way the $65:00 fuel filter didn't do a thing for it..................

 

[miralas]

so i decided to clean my exhaust valves and take a look in there just because i cant hurt, and our dealer has been closed for the long weekend so i cant see about getting a reflash anyway. here's what i saw on the pistons. pic 1 and 2 r of the left piston and 3 and 4 r of the right. the first of each should be the top of the then the second pics will be somewhere in the middle. i can;t tell if that's scaring or just markings on them, and the left has much more than the right. something i should look into you think?

 

[dub]

That is piston scuff. You don't have much time left on that motor!

Look at the top edge of the piston, I bet it is chipping off.

 

[AKSNOWRIDER]

you need to pull that motor down, looks like it scuffed the left piston pretty good...right one is questionable in those shots but its probably scored too...

 

[miralas]

do scored pistons mean the cylinder is going to be damaged or does that not seem like enough damage that it would wreck the cylinder also?what causes scoring? i don't want to tear it down until i get new pistons and gaskets which might have to be a couple weeks til next payday(if i live on cheap fast food and don't drive my car with a lead foot). does the damage seem minimal enough to ride lightly for a day?

the last question seems obvious but i've really got my fingers crossed.

 

[miralas]

so its been some time now, but i ordered up "the Fix" kit from MTNTK and am almost ready to re-assemble. my PTO side piston looked really bad on the intake side so i decided since i was buying new pistons, this kit wouldn't hurt.

i had my cylinder honed and i found a chip of NiCaSil missing from the mag side exhaust port. the picture makes it look much worst than what's seen with the human eye. when the dealer gave it back to me he said it should be replated if i wanted it done right, but the look on he's face didn't seem very concerning. i cant seem to get my personal mechanic in town when i want him to check it out( to busy snowmobiling all the time, go figure) so I'm looking here for more help.

in my mind it doesn't seem that bad because from my understanding the piston leans more on the exhaust side when going up( which would be going with the grain on the chip), rather then coming down( against the grain), so there should be less chance for it to pull the chip more since there's less pressure on it when the edge of the piston ring hits it. the whole end of the chip is in the exhaust port, on the edge. also heard that the NiCaSil grows at the same rate as the aluminum, which should mean that the exposed aluminum should never grow large enough to scrape the piston right?

my mechanic said i should have never gotten it honed and he said the chip probably wasn't there when i took it in. i'm no pro with engines, i can just work on them.

what do you guys think? obviously nothings better than new, but if i want to ride this thing before march( wish i was kidding) then I'm going to have to find away to work with it/deal with it.

 

[PMSPOLARIS]

so its been some time now, but i ordered up "the Fix" kit from MTNTK and am almost ready to re-assemble. my PTO side piston looked really bad on the intake side so i decided since i was buying new pistons, this kit wouldn't hurt.

i had my cylinder honed and i found a chip of NiCaSil missing from the mag side exhaust port. the picture makes it look much worst than what's seen with the human eye. when the dealer gave it back to me he said it should be replated if i wanted it done right, but the look on he's face didn't seem very concerning. i cant seem to get my personal mechanic in town when i want him to check it out( to busy snowmobiling all the time, go figure) so I'm looking here for more help.

in my mind it doesn't seem that bad because from my understanding the piston leans more on the exhaust side when going up( which would be going with the grain on the chip), rather then coming down( against the grain), so there should be less chance for it to pull the chip more since there's less pressure on it when the edge of the piston ring hits it. the whole end of the chip is in the exhaust port, on the edge. also heard that the NiCaSil grows at the same rate as the aluminum, which should mean that the exposed aluminum should never grow large enough to scrape the piston right?

my mechanic said i should have never gotten it honed and he said the chip probably wasn't there when i took it in. i'm no pro with engines, i can just work on them.

what do you guys think? obviously nothings better than new, but if i want to ride this thing before march( wish i was kidding) then I'm going to have to find away to work with it/deal with it.

The problem with the chip is the ring is constantly in tension, and the port edge has to scrub the ring back to the cylinder. No matter what condition the rings are in the rings slightly move out in the port and then get pushed back in as the piston travels up. It does look to me like you need to replate the cylinder. You can slightly bevel the edge of the nicasil and it will last for a while but it is not going to last for a long time. You can do an exchang with millenium or us chrome and turnaround time would be minimal. hope this helps, but I would not run it. it will cost you more in the long run to not fix it now.

 

[miralas]

thanks for the advice. i understand what ur saying about the ring going into the port. makes sense. does anyone else know of any places that will replate or exchange cylinders for a good price? i'm hoping the closer to montana the less the freight will be.

 

[theshadowrider]

Wondering if you have ever done a compression check? Just curious if this type of scuffing would show up with compression check?

 

[miralas]

i've never done one. i just got this sled in december and i've only ridden it twice( first sled, only have been sleddin 3 time, pretty sh**** way to start off a new sport). and the guy that owned it before me knows nothing about sledding other than how to ride one. so i'm assuming there's never been one, unless Curts Polaris in seely lake has done one, thats where he got all his work on it done. if he told them to make sure his sled was ready to go for the winter, is it easy for a dealer to let something like that to slide by? i'd figure if i were one of the best polaris dealers in montana, and i would knew the history of these things, i would check the obvious, especially if my costumer had deep pockets and wanted everything done right...

 

[theshadowrider]

i've never done one. i just got this sled in december and i've only ridden it twice( first sled, only have been sleddin 3 time, pretty sh**** way to start off a new sport). and the guy that owned it before me knows nothing about sledding other than how to ride one. so i'm assuming there's never been one, unless Curts Polaris in seely lake has done one, thats where he got all his work on it done. if he told them to make sure his sled was ready to go for the winter, is it easy for a dealer to let something like that to slide by? i'd figure if i were one of the best polaris dealers in montana, and i would knew the history of these things, i would check the obvious, especially if my costumer had deep pockets and wanted everything done right...

Compression check is really only valuable for checking one cylinder to the other or if you already have a base line that you can check against. I would just consider yourself lucky that you caught this when you did. Could of been deep in the back country and had to been towed out where it may not been possible. Or you could have had a piston skirt break off and go through the bottom of the case taking the entire engine out! That happened to me. I would fix it including re-plating the cylinder and then do a compression check for a baseline. Then you can recheck compression to keep eye on it.

I saw you ordered the "fix". IMO the two major problems (i said major, not only!)with the dragons are piston slap due to clearance issues and lean spot do to poor fuel mapping. I think some get lucky and have tight engines, but all have lean spots. Not sure if it's in your budget to put a fuel controller and egts on it but that would be what I put on the list to things to do. Make sure when riding on the trail to riding spot not to hold the throttle in midrange for more than a few seconds. Just vary the throttle. Once you are to your riding spot is generally not a problem because you are already doing that. If you had egts you would see what everyone is talking about. Your egts will shoot up well over 1300.


Ps. Welcome to snowmobiling! Working on them is part of the fun/challenge/frustration/cost/rewards!

 

[miralas]

well i just filed my taxes and i recieved a much larger amount than expected back, so i think i'll wait a week and do it right, and maybe think about a power commander also. who has them at a good price?

 

[modrmk]

so i decided to clean my exhaust valves and take a look in there just because i cant hurt, and our dealer has been closed for the long weekend so i cant see about getting a reflash anyway. here's what i saw on the pistons. pic 1 and 2 r of the left piston and 3 and 4 r of the right. the first of each should be the top of the then the second pics will be somewhere in the middle. i can;t tell if that's scaring or just markings on them, and the left has much more than the right. something i should look into you think?

That looks like a single ring piston, if that is the case, the new updated top end has not been put on. Just my .02

 

[PAT2]

Good call on the single ring piston. Looks like it to me but hard to tell in pic. If you could find good dealer MIGHT get it replaced for free. How many miles on the sled?

 

[miralas]

it was the two ring pistons. and when i called the shop that worked on it all the time for the previous owner, they pretty much told me tough luck. the local dealer who just honed my cylinders for me, along with just sent my cylinder out to be replated didn't have any input as far as getting free parts. just been bending over and taken it ever since i bought it, but trying not to let it discourage me.