2019 Super Hero Builds 19' Honda CRF450R w/ 2020 Yeti 129 FR (FBS) 18’ Yamaha YZ450F w/ 2020 Yeti 137 MTN (FBS)

[Chadx]

Thats for gas engines not diesel?

It's oil. It's for both. That's the easy answer. Ha.
It is rated for both gas and diesel motors so when I say it's a diesel oil, I'm referring to it being rated for diesel. Diesel engine oils, like mobil 1, tend to be formulated in such a way that they are safe for wetclutches, much like the rotella diesel oil so many use in snowbikes. No friction modifiers and no "energy conserving" rating.

I don't want to highjack this thread anymore. Plenty of oil threads.
Back to the bike builds!

 

[byeatts]

There are so many variables here and pointing at the oil as the culprit may not be warranted.. It could simply be the design of the Blue bikes,oil journals, The material of the bearings, who knows, our 20 KTM,s running T6 for years have been trouble free, I dont think Shell makes an inferior product

 

[byeatts]

agreed not an oil thread, Perhaps is the rider that is the culprit! lol

 

[needpowder]

He does seem to have more than the usual amount of engine issues. Bad luck?

 

[tillbuilt]

Like others have quoted. I have run Rotella T6 in every snow bike I have owned and some of them are well over 100hrs. This is the first stock engine failure I have had out of 20 something shop bikes. We put at least 200hrs. a year on snow bikes so we see a lot more than the average rider that does 40hrs a season.

I have had many Hot Rod motors built, and have have had some failures when they get over that magical 10hp. increase in power. That is just the price you pay to have big power!!! I build stock to slightly modified bikes for customers that are VERY reliable, but they all want more power, so I build hot rods for shop bikes trying to make big power - reliable. Unfortunately I have not found a package that I feel comfortable with selling to customers so the quest continues.

 

[tillbuilt]

I'd kind of forgotten about this but one of the FX's where the piston cracked also had a bad main bearing. The inner race lost its plating, it didn't fail but it was just a matter of time. When your YZ let I'm assuming there was no trace of metal in previous oil changes?

There was nothing in the oil, then it was very fine silver the next so we took it off the snow and found the bottom end failure.

 

[tillbuilt]

One thing I’m curious as well, you had mentioned that the Honda with the free ride setup was one of the best builds you’ve done, does that mean that the Honda runs way stronger then the Yamaha stock for stock as a Snowbike ? I’m not looking to do a bunch of performance mods, but I’d like the hardest running stock bike. I thought my setup was good, but maybe it could be better with a different colour ? I don’t get the chance to ride other brands of bikes set up as snowbikes often unfortunately.

Yes, the 2019 Honda in close to stock form. ( Yoshi exhaust ) was the strongest, and best snow bike power out of any 2019 we rode on the snow last season. It is heavier than a KTM, but the power, and the way it delivers the power, out rode all the other bikes we built and rode last year. The change that Honda made in 2019 put it at the top of the pile.

 

[dooman92]

Toby, great info on that Honda. More options the better, In my neck of the woods Hondas are more available and cheaper.

 

[byeatts]

We will have a Honda to compare this season, Some KTM info though , Certain years of The Factory bikes can be quite different than the SX model . Some years for instance the 16.5 Factory 450 has a different piston,Forged not cast, higher compression , different cam and ECU/fueling , We found this when local shop was doing a top end,Many of the parts had to come special order and were different part numbers , I put a 17 SX ECU on this factory bike and it barely ran just to see, PR2 sent his ECU and it would not run , I have two factory bikes and the 19 factory looks same as the 19 SX , The 16.5 is not and it runs circles around the other 20 450 builds, Pulls much higher RPM and holds higher gear.You never know what the Factory bikes have inside until you get one.

 

[RmK8oo]

Sweet builds! What are you using to attach the shovel to the pelican case on the Yamaha? That's a great setup.

 

[Chadx]

Sweet builds! What are you using to attach the shovel to the pelican case on the Yamaha? That's a great setup.

Not sure what toby uses, but I've used the Quickfist brand clamps on my last couple builds and they work great. "Original size" works for diameter 1" to 2.25". Make sure to decide what shovel you are using first as it will determine spacing. I keep my tunnel shovel full length rather than collapsed. Only annoyance is there is no longer a nice large flat surface to lay your helmet, etc.


Shouldn't need to be said, but I'll reiterate for the masses...tunnel shovel is a second shovel for easy access. Primary avalanche shovel is on my person with probe and transceiver.

 

[RmK8oo]

Thank you Chadx

 

[tillbuilt]

Thank you Chadx

Yes, That is what I use also. They are great. I even use them to hold my NOS bottles in my trailer.

 

[Chadx]

Toby,
Any early season impressions for the two length yeti kits? How about your built yamaha? Or are you suffering the same warm and dry temps as we are in parts of Montana? Yuck. Was 50 degrees yesterday here in Bozeman (and 43 this morning at 7am) and little to no snow in the forecast. Have made it out on short shakeout ride and one normal ride locally but will have to travel for our next trip it seems to find snow There are a few places getting snow within dayride distances (3 hours one way drive) but might just pack up with a buddy and head further if need be.

Just curious if you've been able to rack up some time on these builds and any early season observations?

My only observation so far is the yeti accessory bogie wheels are fragile. Did a short 10 mile smooth-trail shakeout first ride on my new build then a mellow 30 mile regular ride (some deep trail moguls but didn't really pound them, was slow speed and mostly riding a foot off the trail, then the rest of the day in the powder offtrail). One bogie wheel must have broke the bolt as the entire bogie unit was completely gone except for the outer plate (bolt was torqued correctly, used blue loctite, and all bolts checked prior to this ride). The other bogie unit was still there including the bearing, but the black plastic bogie wheel itself is missing. Observed some hyfax wear on the side that was missing completely so that side must have broken earlier in the day than the other side (see picture of slightly melted hyfax on the "missing side" and broken off black plastic bogie). That both bogie units were damaged the first trip doesn't make me hopeful, but fingers crossed it was a fluke and i just hit a rogue mogul harder than i recall. I'm easy on equipment so the guys hard on stuff won't stand a chance. Ha.

Any experience with bogies on your end? Since you mentioned folks should run them on the 2020 with narrow rail, I assume you are running them. Can you show a picture of your install location so I can compare? The yeti install video is on an older model with different rails, but I eyeballed the distance forward of the front shock mount and bend of the rail and believe they were mounted in the best location. Ready to share or sell the front ski scratcher setup? If it will lube the hyfax satisfactory, that solution is likely cheaper and more robust than yeti bogie wheels. Not cheap.

Let's hear more about your built up yamaha, how the honda is doing and how the two different yeti track lengths perform early season conditions. Thanks!

 

[byeatts]

I am also interested in scratchers, However the ski is in line with the track and its not likely a ski scratcher with get the snow around the track and to the hyfax. Regular skid scratchers will likely work far better. And as a long time mod sled builder opening up the track windows just 1/4 will allow snow to get up into the area pretty easy, We had this very same issue when the 3 inch sled tracks first came out" Some small track porting was needed to fix the sled issues as well, very likely will do some small track porting 5/8 holes to pull in just enough snow for hyfax.

 

[tillbuilt]

Yes, I have lots of experience with bogie wheels, and have run them for three years now. Unfortunately yours are mounted in the wrong position. When the suspension compresses the shock and spring contact the boogie wheel where you have them located and will break and shear them off. Take a look at the pictures I have attached. This is the correct mounting position.

Toby,
Any early season impressions for the two length yeti kits? How about your built yamaha? Or are you suffering the same warm and dry temps as we are in parts of Montana? Yuck. Was 50 degrees yesterday here in Bozeman (and 43 this morning at 7am) and little to no snow in the forecast. Have made it out on short shakeout ride and one normal ride locally but will have to travel for our next trip it seems to find snow There are a few places getting snow within dayride distances (3 hours one way drive) but might just pack up with a buddy and head further if need be.

Just curious if you've been able to rack up some time on these builds and any early season observations?

My only observation so far is the yeti accessory bogie wheels are fragile. Did a short 10 mile smooth-trail shakeout first ride on my new build then a mellow 30 mile regular ride (some deep trail moguls but didn't really pound them, was slow speed and mostly riding a foot off the trail, then the rest of the day in the powder offtrail). One bogie wheel must have broke the bolt as the entire bogie unit was completely gone except for the outer plate (bolt was torqued correctly, used blue loctite, and all bolts checked prior to this ride). The other bogie unit was still there including the bearing, but the black plastic bogie wheel itself is missing. Observed some hyfax wear on the side that was missing completely so that side must have broken earlier in the day than the other side (see picture of slightly melted hyfax on the "missing side" and broken off black plastic bogie). That both bogie units were damaged the first trip doesn't make me hopeful, but fingers crossed it was a fluke and i just hit a rogue mogul harder than i recall. I'm easy on equipment so the guys hard on stuff won't stand a chance. Ha.

Any experience with bogies on your end? Since you mentioned folks should run them on the 2020 with narrow rail, I assume you are running them. Can you show a picture of your install location so I can compare? The yeti install video is on an older model with different rails, but I eyeballed the distance forward of the front shock mount and bend of the rail and believe they were mounted in the best location. Ready to share or sell the front ski scratcher setup? If it will lube the hyfax satisfactory, that solution is likely cheaper and more robust than yeti bogie wheels. Not cheap.

Let's hear more about your built up yamaha, how the honda is doing and how the two different yeti track lengths perform early season conditions. Thanks!


View attachment 336539

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Chadx]

Thanks Toby! So Yeti has some explaining to do. Ha. No instructions with bogies except they tell you to see the video instructions on their website which instructs mounting them in front of the shock. Surprised this hasn't come up before. If this is a matter of the 2020 narrow rails setup forcing a change in bogie wheel mount location, one would think this was known by yeti from having the narrow rail SS versions on the snow previous years. So the wide rail spacing must have room for the shock to clear so there are different locations needed depending on wide or narrow rail spacing.

Needing to mount bogies that far back seems a bit far back from the typical hot spot (you can see the hyfax melt in my picture starts fairly far forward), but if that is the only place with clearance, better than nothing.

Yeti needs to advise dealerships of this change as well as the consumer and needs to include instructions with the bogie wheels that point out different mounting locations for different models. I'll work through this with my dealer and with yeti. Thanks for the correction, Toby!

Here is the official yeti instructional video showing them installed in front of the front shock (and no mention of an alternate mounting location depending on model):